Rowan Martin-Hughes ([info]elfishski) wrote,
@ 2005-12-04 23:00:00
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Entry tags:game theory, notes, uni

The Savanna Principle
I've been reading about the Savanna Principle (or one paper at least), which is the idea that the human brain is inherently biased towards not really understanding concepts that didn't exist back in the hunter-gatherer days in the African Savanna, known as the Environment of Evolutionary Adaptiveness (EEA).


As the paper states it, the idea behind this comes from a couple of assumptions/generalisations:
1 - There isn't anything special about Homo Sapiens, we're "unique like every other species", in that our uniqueness evolved from our adaptation to our environment, back in the day
2 - There isn't anything special about the human brain compared to other body parts, in the way it evolved to fulfill a special function

Fundamentally, the human body hasn't changed in the last 10 000 years, so the idea is that the brain remains in pretty much the same state. This would be one explanation for why children take a reasonably long time to learn to distinguish people in real life to people on TV, and indeed, studies have shown that people never really do - those who watch certain types of TV shows (soaps and similar, I expect), rate themselves as having greater satisfaction with their social lives, as if they have those people as actual friends.


This relates to a lot of game theory experiments as people don't react the way game theory predicts during experiments.
One such experiment is where the players are given money each round for a number of rounds - they keep the money at the end of the game, though I assume it's relatively small amounts. They have the choice of just keeping it, or contributing some portion of it to the "common good", which means that the value of the contribution is doubled (for instance), and it is then redistributed equally to everyone playing the game. If you consider this, everyone will obviously be better off if everyone else contributes, but individually the best choice is just to keep your money each round because assuming there's more than 2 players then you get less money if you contribute.

Yet people contribute anyway. The argument of the Savanna Principle is that the concept of being completely anonymous and playing a one-off game is essentially not something that the brain ever had to deal with during the EEA, you'd have to deal with the same people every day, so "defecting" in the Prisoner's Dilemma game (which is what this essentially is) is just not natural, even when it's entirely logical. Naturally, this is good for society :)

Of course, not everyone contributes, and over time the people who do get fed up and start to just keep their money, so eventually we get what game theory might have expected to start with. The game gets more complex when you add in the option for people to "spend" money to punish people who don't cooperate (i.e. at the end of each round every player can spend $1 to cost another player $2 or whatever units are appropriate). Naturally punishing other players is even more "irrational" from a purely selfish viewpoint, but people will engage in this too, and sooner or later the vast majority are probably cooperating, so long as there are enough "punishers" in the initial population.

It's pretty interesting stuff, but that's enough typing for now, although I haven't done the topic justice. I'll have to read some more before I make up my mind as to whether it makes sense or whether it's a load of hogwash.




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(Anonymous)
2005-12-04 11:44 pm UTC (link)
Hmm... I'm not sure.
What you're saying makes sense, but if we don't deal with things that we didn't have in the African Savannah, then how do we cope with being the "top" species? In Africa there are lots of predators to humans. We had to outwit them. Everywhere else we just use our wits to subdue what's there. How do people cope with large cities, I mean, how far removed is the average LA resident from the average hunter-gatherer of 10 000 years ago? And the lifespans are no shorter, despite the removal from air, grass, water, predators and prey. The assumption that we haven't changed surely must be false, it's quite clear that physically humans ARE evolving, there's always the suit of armour argument - todays marine could never fit in a medieval suit of armour! We are taller, faster, stronger. We have no reason to be in many senses, as we're less threatened, but as we're less threatened we can put more of our resources into growing instead of running, I guess.
There's that article on God that Dave turned up recently on his LJ...
http://proof-of-god.freewebsitehosting.com/Hammond5s1.html
I don't claim it's not dodgy, but this says in many ways the opposite, just doesn't talk about game theory. I don't see what relevance the example is to hunter-gatherers anyway. Money is an abstract concept. I guess you could play with cows. Or sheafs of wheat.
I think it begs a question of "community". If people feel they have a community with those around them, then they will always contribute to the common good. Some people are greedy, but these people don't understand or believe in community. To test this game you need to not only study what people do in the situation, but the background of those people playing - one would expect a CWA lady to contribute but a lawyer to keep, for instance. This is why in small places communities are built, because it makes everyone be able to survive (example: there is only a couple of hay-making aparatus (apparatii?!) in Southern Tasmania, the farmers cooperate so everyone gets their hay done, it can't be done by one man). In a city (Canberra is a great example, because almost all the residents work for the government or the uni and thus have good wages) services are provided but not on a barter system, but a money system, and so the more money you have, the more stuff you can get. This makes the aim of life to get more money by whatever means possible, rather than to get the most done, which is best achieved in teams.
I suspect on some level everyone has the ability to be selfish or sharing, but upbringing and lifestyle make one more biased, I suspect (of course there will be odd ones out), but this makes the punishment process you mention necessary, to instill a sense of community by making selfish people feel left out - make them hunt their own game and cut their own hay - they get ALL the meat and ALL the hay, but they have to work harder. In your game they needn't work harder, but they do screw everyone else over, which builds resentment, no community, so the community thing eventually kicks in, even if it occurs buy voting a few people off the island, as such.

This isn't PDEs. I should go :)

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[info]pappubahry
2005-12-06 01:56 am UTC (link)
Can't we explain the taller, stronger, fasterness by better nutrition and sanitation?

Apparatus or apparatuses.

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(Anonymous)
2005-12-06 03:07 am UTC (link)
Yes and no, I think. I may be wrong, but do we have better nutrition? We eat *better* food and a wider variety, including fruits, vegetables, red and white meats, but I don't know if that's directly the same as more nutritious. Food which is not chemical raised and bred to be the biggest, juiciest and cleanest it can, will contain more trace elements and microbes, which are also essential to our health (I'm not pro-organic, no aphids = good. But.). We have to add stuff to what we eat and drink to make it nutritious because our farming practises remove a lot of that. On a slightly different note to where this started, recently on Foreign Correspondant or something like that there was a doctor who works in Nepal a few months each year, taking iodised salt to the people there who suffer huge thyroid issues because all their salt is pure (NaCl, no I's). In Aus we used to be fine because there was lots of iodine in our milk, but the farmers now clean their milkers with chlorine instead, and we're becoming iodine deficient. We have the knowledge now of how much of everything we need, instead of just taking whatever the Earth provides, but I think the idea that we need all these boosters means we don't really have it quite right.

Thank you. I dind't think it was apparatii, but I wasn't sure whether apparatus is like sheep and fish :)

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[info]elfishski
2005-12-07 12:13 pm UTC (link)
But I like apparatii. Just like walrii. Moving along.

Not just better nutrition and sanitation, but steroids fed to a large portion of the food we eat, all that sort of thing too. But the fact that we get diseased less, and most of us don't have a shortage of food (and the right types of food) is a much bigger factor than back in medieval times.

Without doing a trace of actual research on this, I'd guess that the size of people now is bigger than that of people in the middle ages, but at the same time there probably isn't a big difference between the size of people then, and the size of people in the hunter-gatherer days. I could be wrong though.

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[info]elfishski
2005-12-07 12:09 pm UTC (link)
I think the point with the concept (regardless of whether it's correct) is that at some fundamental level the human brain when faced with concepts in this day and age, relates them back to the closest parallel it can find from when it evolved. So money and the whole trading system is okay, as the early humans presumably traded amongst themselves.

But in hunter-gatherer times, there was NO WAY for people to communicate directly without seeing each other in person, and they lived in small bands of people, where social ranking was important. So when faced with an experiment like what I've described they relate it back to the situation where they are do know the other players and want to cooperate to preserve the community.

The points you've made are good I think, but I don't think they necessarily argue against the Savanna Principle; one can equally argue that the mean ol' lawyer you mention doesn't cooperate because he's learned to ignore his primal urge to be nice, just like people can ignore the desire for sweets and fats which is inbuilt in humans thanks to the days when such things were hard to come by and very important for nutrition.

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(Anonymous)
2005-12-07 11:57 pm UTC (link)
Can you ignore your need for sweets, fats and free food?! :)

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[info]elfishski
2005-12-08 02:52 am UTC (link)
Hey, now free food is different. That's like finding a gazelle that's just tripped and fallen on it's head. You can't say no.

It's free.

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(Anonymous)
2005-12-08 05:55 am UTC (link)
waaa! No! That's sad!! :( I am not a lion! (despite fur), I would take it to the nearest vet!

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